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	<title>Comments on: Mike in The Nation</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/</link>
	<description>Sharpening my knife</description>
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		<title>By: pushmedia1</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8179</link>
		<dc:creator>pushmedia1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 21:00:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8179</guid>
		<description>Someone should look into this...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone should look into this&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: gabe</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8178</link>
		<dc:creator>gabe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:51:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8178</guid>
		<description>&quot;did those episodes result from policies that in net increased welfare?&quot;

Well, it seems that analyses like Calvo-Loo-Kung are looking at a tradeoff between benefits from financial deregulation with the costs, but where can we see the benefits empirically?  Growth was no better in the USA after financial deregulation than before.  The costs are clear in the current crisis.  First benefits need to be established, and they haven&#039;t been yet, otherwise there are only minuses.  

Basically, some benefit from financial deregulation has to established.  Currently, supporters of financial deregulation, when faced with the current crisis, handwave about some &quot;benefits&quot; from deregulation, and then equivocate.  

From Calvo-Loo-Kung &quot;Although it is much harder to establish that financial development causes growth, few would doubt that, at least temporarily, financial deregulation could promote higher growth.&quot;  Well, actually I would.

&quot;We base our analysis on estimates of the costs of financial crises in emerging market economies (since the 1980s), a cauldron of financial crises in the last thirty years.&quot;

Their selection of dates is very convenient, where they use the low period as the 1980s, which was Latin America&#039;s lost decade.  A more useful comparison would be the 1950-1960s where financial deregulation hadn&#039;t begun anywhere, even Chile, but this was not a low growth period, which is probably why this wasn&#039;t done.  Plus, there are many different policies enacted over this period, some good and some bad.  Argentina&#039;s boom in the 1990s was not just about financial deregulation.  Also, n=2 right?

So to have a real discussion about welfare, we need to find some more numbers on welfare benefits from financial deregulation, so far I&#039;m not convinced.  Welfare concerns are important, but I&#039;d be willing to sacrifice a non-zero amount of output  to never see 10% unemployment again.  How has welfare in the USA increased on net from financial deregulation?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;did those episodes result from policies that in net increased welfare?&#8221;</p>
<p>Well, it seems that analyses like Calvo-Loo-Kung are looking at a tradeoff between benefits from financial deregulation with the costs, but where can we see the benefits empirically?  Growth was no better in the USA after financial deregulation than before.  The costs are clear in the current crisis.  First benefits need to be established, and they haven&#8217;t been yet, otherwise there are only minuses.  </p>
<p>Basically, some benefit from financial deregulation has to established.  Currently, supporters of financial deregulation, when faced with the current crisis, handwave about some &#8220;benefits&#8221; from deregulation, and then equivocate.  </p>
<p>From Calvo-Loo-Kung &#8220;Although it is much harder to establish that financial development causes growth, few would doubt that, at least temporarily, financial deregulation could promote higher growth.&#8221;  Well, actually I would.</p>
<p>&#8220;We base our analysis on estimates of the costs of financial crises in emerging market economies (since the 1980s), a cauldron of financial crises in the last thirty years.&#8221;</p>
<p>Their selection of dates is very convenient, where they use the low period as the 1980s, which was Latin America&#8217;s lost decade.  A more useful comparison would be the 1950-1960s where financial deregulation hadn&#8217;t begun anywhere, even Chile, but this was not a low growth period, which is probably why this wasn&#8217;t done.  Plus, there are many different policies enacted over this period, some good and some bad.  Argentina&#8217;s boom in the 1990s was not just about financial deregulation.  Also, n=2 right?</p>
<p>So to have a real discussion about welfare, we need to find some more numbers on welfare benefits from financial deregulation, so far I&#8217;m not convinced.  Welfare concerns are important, but I&#8217;d be willing to sacrifice a non-zero amount of output  to never see 10% unemployment again.  How has welfare in the USA increased on net from financial deregulation?</p>
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		<title>By: pushmedia1</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8174</link>
		<dc:creator>pushmedia1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 04:23:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8174</guid>
		<description>gabe, did those episodes result from policies that in net increased welfare?

&quot;New Deal financial regulation&quot; is Glass-Stiegel?  If so, same question.  Are we optimizing by minimizing the risk of systemic disruption (whatever that is) or are we maximizing welfare?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>gabe, did those episodes result from policies that in net increased welfare?</p>
<p>&#8220;New Deal financial regulation&#8221; is Glass-Stiegel?  If so, same question.  Are we optimizing by minimizing the risk of systemic disruption (whatever that is) or are we maximizing welfare?</p>
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		<title>By: gabe</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8172</link>
		<dc:creator>gabe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 21:25:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8172</guid>
		<description>&quot;A long time transpired between banking crises in the US.&quot;  Yes, but you can also look historically to the financial panic and bank crises pre-New Deal, like 1837, 1873, 1893, 1907, etc.  Between history and international evidence, there should be enough data.  Many bank were allowed to fail during these episodes and there weren&#039;t bailouts like the current one.

Basically, how do we apply the successful New Deal financial regulation to the shadow banking system?  For me, that&#039;s the main question.  How many banking or financial crises between 1933 and 1980?  That&#039;s no coincidence.  This is why there has been a long time between banking crises.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;A long time transpired between banking crises in the US.&#8221;  Yes, but you can also look historically to the financial panic and bank crises pre-New Deal, like 1837, 1873, 1893, 1907, etc.  Between history and international evidence, there should be enough data.  Many bank were allowed to fail during these episodes and there weren&#8217;t bailouts like the current one.</p>
<p>Basically, how do we apply the successful New Deal financial regulation to the shadow banking system?  For me, that&#8217;s the main question.  How many banking or financial crises between 1933 and 1980?  That&#8217;s no coincidence.  This is why there has been a long time between banking crises.</p>
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		<title>By: pushmedia1</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8171</link>
		<dc:creator>pushmedia1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 19:59:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8171</guid>
		<description>Did those economies collapse?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did those economies collapse?</p>
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		<title>By: swong</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8170</link>
		<dc:creator>swong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 19:33:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8170</guid>
		<description>There have been a couple of bank failures in the game economies of Second Life and Eve Online. The data from those collapses is probably more interesting than useful...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There have been a couple of bank failures in the game economies of Second Life and Eve Online. The data from those collapses is probably more interesting than useful&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: pushmedia1</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8167</link>
		<dc:creator>pushmedia1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 22:34:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8167</guid>
		<description>Clearly, those that supported the bailouts had a model of bank failures in their heads.  The point is you can&#039;t test such a model because we never observe the systemic effects of non-bailed out bank failures.  This may be because they don&#039;t exist or because bailing out banks removes the systemic effects.

Or do you imagine we can derive from first principles the perfect bank failure model with no need to subject it to data?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clearly, those that supported the bailouts had a model of bank failures in their heads.  The point is you can&#8217;t test such a model because we never observe the systemic effects of non-bailed out bank failures.  This may be because they don&#8217;t exist or because bailing out banks removes the systemic effects.</p>
<p>Or do you imagine we can derive from first principles the perfect bank failure model with no need to subject it to data?</p>
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		<title>By: ssendam</title>
		<link>http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/2009/11/mike-in-the-nation/comment-page-1/#comment-8165</link>
		<dc:creator>ssendam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 21:01:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ambrosini.us/wordpress/?p=1278#comment-8165</guid>
		<description>If only we had a model of an economy with banks and bank failures...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If only we had a model of an economy with banks and bank failures&#8230;</p>
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